Following the iron brush

Hello,

I would like to know whether any of you do know anything about the methods Japanese do use to produce those very thin slices (0,1 mm) of pearl nacre. Any and every bit of information would be well appreciated.

And something off topic:

I wish all of you a very happy Year of the Tiger!

Have a nice day!

János

Hi Janos..

Are you sure you mean 0.1 mm? I've seen tiny slices of MOP but can't remember seeing anything that fine. Have you got a picture perhaps

Clive

Clive,

Yes, you can quite easily get hold of very thin sections ( about 0.2mm) of MOP in Japan and it's not particularly expensive either. I actually have some myself. Don't think I've seen 0.1mm either though.
I'm afraid that I have no idea how this is produced. Perhaps thicker slices are temporarily glued to a support of some sort and simply ground down.

Ford.. I'm fimiliar with the contemporary stuff , most of it's cut using CNC.

Check this out!!

From http://www.frets.com/FRETSPages/FieldTr ... ellis.html

bonkers!...isn't it? Although, to be honest, I don't find this sort of computer aided work at all satisfying. Then again it's really only fancy decoration work.

Hello,

Thank you for the replies. My question was concerned with those thin sheets of mother of pearl and abalone Japanese have used on ‘raden’ lacquerware since at least the early Edo period. “Thin pearl” or ‘usugai’ was/is a distinct decorative technique with a distinctive advantage: these very thin, flexible pearl sheets can be applied to curved surfaces too. The artisan soaks the sheets in water for a night or so, and the soaked sheets can be cut wit knifes, shears or even punches to shape.

As far as I know Japanese craftsmen produced these sheets well before the advent of modern lapidary cutting equipment. Perhaps I am wrong on this, but I have the suspicion that the pearl sheets have been cut or split with knives, after some kind of chemical treatment that rendered them soft and pliable.
I have read a few pages on oriental lacquer and made some experiments myself, but I do not reached a solution yet. Oh, those masters of old… with their “dirty little tricks”…

http://www1.odn.ne.jp/j-lacquer/home_eng.html

http://urushiya.ocnk.net/product-list/52

Thank you for your help!

Have a nice day!

János

Hi János,

We've discussed this issue of softening nacre previously [ here's a link to that discussion] and while there are persistent rumours that this is possible we've come to the conclusion that this is based on a misunderstanding of processes that are possible with horn and turtle shell, very different substances to MOP. Nacre is essentially calcium carbonate and thus very friable (crumbly) and attempts to soften it using various acids or vinegars only yielded a mushy pulp

You'll notice that the thin sheets of MOP are actually produced by cutting right across any layering within the material. I don't think there is a quick or secret trick to this. Only patience

Lorenzo did mention, however, that a gentleman he knows in Japan boils abalone shell until the layers separate. This is used in raden work...but obviously the layers are not flat, just thin.

Dear Ford,

I have found that thread myself, actually, what Lorenzo did mention there was the “starter” of my question. I can not find out yet how these thin slices were/are produced, but soaking them in water overnight makes them quite pliable (at least for the cutting out of a pattern, and for the application to a bent surface, to the side of a round box, for example).
I boiled mother of pearl plates in water (1,2~1,3 mm thick white MOP) to show what will happen to them. No delamination at all… not even a hint of it… I tested the hardness with a knife, and the mother of pearl was somewhat softer than before boiling. But for a short time only.
I do not think that thick mother of pearl plates can be bent like horn or something similar. But I do suspect that there is some treatment or method which can make mother of pearl soft and pliable enough to be cut or sliced thinly with knives, just like knife cut wood veneer, where the wood is steamed or boiled before being sliced, to avoid heavy checking, breaking, and splitting of the cut surfaces. This is what I am interested in: to produce those thin slices of mother of pearl with my own hands. Just to acquire a little bit deeper understanding of things, as the saying goes… And because I am quite curious by nature… like a cat or something.

Thank you for your help!

Have a nice day!

János

Whops I am sorry I have never seen this topic

Sorry if I gave the impression of ignoring you Janos. Your new post of today allowed me to see this for the first time.

I show you the work of Mr. Tanaka, an artist living in Okayama.



He told me in person that starting from pieces like this:



And boiling it, he obtain some very thin layers (he referred at this using the image of book pages) to be lacquered on the back later to obtain various effects.



I have no experience in this, I am just reporting what he told me face to face in Japanese translated by my wife in Italian to me.
If this information is vital to you I can try to send Tanaka an email and ask for more, but he is not the kind of person who gives away easily his knowledge, so I do not expect much more than what I could already offer.

Dear Lorenzo,

No offence… I am intrigued by everything craft, so I always have been keen to know how craftsmen work and do things.

Your experience is a further proof of the possibility of softening and thinly slicing mother of pearl. Perhaps something has been lost in translation, because acetic acid or clean water does not soften MoP sufficiently (I have done some experiments, in fact, acetic acid /or perhaps any acid, for that matter/ dissolves MoP). But thinly sliced MoP is a reality, a commodity sold by Japanese traders of lacquering supplies, and used for at least three centuries by artisans.

This field deserves further investigation to crack the secrets of the trade. But I know from experience that craftsmen tend to being mysterious and secretive. Especially those old school Japanese ones.

Have a nice day!

János

Lorenzo... please do e-mail him as this question has facinated me for some time as well.. ask him what precisely he boils the MOP in and for how long.

Ok, I'll give a try but I can't guarantee a fast reply. I'll be in Japan next Christmas, face to face could be easier.